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    • 61 posts
    October 30, 2011 7:31 AM PDT

    Has anybody thought of UEFI Secure Boot (MS)? Or am I maybe a little early with this?

    (Headline or 'topic-line' does not work? 'UEFI' as topic-header would be right.)


    This post was edited by Gerrit rijnsma at October 30, 2011 8:44 AM PDT
    • 170 posts
    October 30, 2011 8:23 AM PDT

    You do mean with Windows 8? I get a tech newsletter that said you will have option to disable........


    This post was edited by Leenie Gilmore at October 30, 2011 8:28 AM PDT
    • 61 posts
    October 30, 2011 8:41 AM PDT

    That would be great, but I don't believe it will always be the case. It is the OEM, the hardware-producer who will decide that I think. And why would they do something for Linux when a great deal of users have Windows?


    This post was edited by Gerrit rijnsma at October 30, 2011 8:46 AM PDT
    • 170 posts
    October 30, 2011 2:26 PM PDT
    Nope this is a Microsoft thing for Windows 8. Microsoft says you will have to go into BIOS to disable it...
    • 61 posts
    October 30, 2011 3:23 PM PDT

    UEFI is OEM. It is also another way of booting (also partition-likewise).
    Secure Boot is the certification-part of the story. Garret of Red Hat for instance has been red of angryness en sorrow about this.
    MS demands it 'on' when shipping.
    In some machines it will be switchable, but not in all cases. MS is 90% of the market. Why would an OEM make it switchable?

    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/09/26/uefi_linux_lock_out_row_latest/

    http://addon.100searchengines.com/texis/open/search?q=uefi+garret+red+hat

    Etcetera.

    The FSF:

    http://www.networkworld.com/community/blog/free-software-foundation-petitions-against-wi

     


    This post was edited by Gerrit rijnsma at October 30, 2011 3:34 PM PDT
    • 170 posts
    October 30, 2011 3:41 PM PDT
    This could be a problem for Linux users: http://mjg59.livejournal.com/138973.html
    • 61 posts
    October 30, 2011 3:55 PM PDT

    Yes...

    quote

    " There's no indication that Microsoft will prevent vendors from providing firmware support for disabling this feature and running unsigned code. However, experience indicates that many firmware vendors and OEMs are interested in providing only the minimum of firmware functionality required for their market. It's almost certainly the case that some systems will ship with the option of disabling this. Equally, it's almost certainly the case that some systems won't.

    It's probably not worth panicking yet. But it is worth being concerned. "

    end-quote

    I'm not very comfortable with it.

     



    This post was edited by Gerrit rijnsma at October 30, 2011 4:02 PM PDT
    • 170 posts
    October 30, 2011 5:57 PM PDT
    Me neither, I can't afford Windows 8, but I can buy a motherboard......
    • 61 posts
    October 31, 2011 2:01 AM PDT
    When all can be switched nothing is wrong.
    Only partitioning could be different with UEFI. It is one FAT32, in it a special program, and then normal partitions I believe.
    https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UEFIBooting.
    • 170 posts
    November 2, 2011 3:50 PM PDT
    This just in...http://www.zdnet.com/blog/bott/leading-pc-makers-confirm-no-windows-8-plot-to-lock-out-linux/4185?tag=nl.e539 I pray it's true.
    • 61 posts
    November 3, 2011 3:31 AM PDT

    Sigh of relieve. But... UEFI will not make life easier I suspect.

    https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UEFIBooting

    And: 'Secure Boot' of Microsoft® is not the same as UEFI. They could demand certificates or keys when one dualboots Windows and Linux. No problem for me I'm happy to say, for 8 years I don't use Windows now.

    Thanks for the link Leenie!
    Let's wait and see. :big smile:


    This post was edited by Gerrit rijnsma at November 3, 2011 3:41 AM PDT
    • Moderator
    • 563 posts
    November 3, 2011 7:08 AM PDT
    I always laugh about these security "control" mechanisms as they are usually circumvented within 24 hours. The Linux community is to big, and the sum of all those brains far outnumber the folks coming up with these things. :) I am not worried at all.
    • 61 posts
    November 3, 2011 7:21 AM PDT
    biff baxter said:
    I always laugh about these security "control" mechanisms as they are usually circumvented within 24 hours. The Linux community is to big, and the sum of all those brains far outnumber the folks coming up with these things. :) I am not worried at all.

    I hope you are right. More people write this on the web. But this is hard- and software and not very simple.

    It also concernes 'third party' drivers, usb, dvd etc.

    What I know is that Suse (Novell) would have the certification-keys and -variables and maybe this would be a way to get them for Linux. But I'm not an expert in this field.

    In the meantime:

    http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-source/free-software-foundation-urges-oems-to-say-no-to-mandatory-windows-8-uefi-cage/9770

     

     


    This post was edited by Gerrit rijnsma at November 3, 2011 7:32 AM PDT
    • 6 posts
    November 15, 2011 10:17 AM PST

    MS could argue that they want it for the best intentions i.e. to produce safe systems and let's face it their track record in this respect is dire. However I see that it has potential to lock-out other OS's, like Linux, or indeed older MS OS's. If it can be seen as being anti-competitive then the European Commission will come down on them like a ton of bricks, (as they have done before).


    This post was edited by John Smith at November 15, 2011 10:19 AM PST
    • 61 posts
    November 15, 2011 10:33 AM PST

    John Smith wrote:
    If it can be seen as being anti-competitive
    Right. But can it, because of hardware-makers, who deliver a facillity which will by accident be used by MS.
    And switchable or not? Why would they with 90% MS users?

    Maybe it is no big deal. I hope the FSF does a great job. And also the Australians. Europe is a little weak at the moment.

    But it is good to be aware...! MS is a rather clever business. Maybe you like to call it sneaky.

     


    This post was edited by Gerrit rijnsma at November 15, 2011 10:37 AM PST
    • 170 posts
    November 19, 2011 7:58 AM PST
    This just in!!!! http://www.zdnet.com/blog/hardware/security-researcher-creates-windows-8-bootkit/16365?tag=nl.e539
    • 61 posts
    November 19, 2011 8:16 AM PST
    I had a good laugh when I read it.
    At the same time MS will use it as an incentive to promote 'restricted boot' like we call it these days.
    • 170 posts
    November 19, 2011 8:27 AM PST
    I thought you'd like it. No doubt people are working on it as we type....
    • 61 posts
    November 19, 2011 9:15 AM PST

    Great, that's why it has to be known and that's why it has to be talked about in my opinion. All over the world. :wink:
    http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2011/09/will-the-accc-block-win8-secure-boot/

     


    This post was edited by Gerrit rijnsma at November 19, 2011 9:15 AM PST
    • 170 posts
    January 19, 2012 2:31 PM PST
    Very interesting article: http://www.techrepublic.com/blog/opensource/microsoft-back-to-dirty-pool-with-uefi-secure-boot/3349?tag=nl.e076
    • 61 posts
    January 20, 2012 3:00 AM PST

    Quote: Microsoft has little to no foothold in the world of ARM. We’re talking handsets and tablets. Both of those bits of technology rest securely in the hands of Apple and Android. But we know how Microsoft feels about competition. They want (and understandably so) to get their hands into that pie. End-quote.
    Yes...
    Dirty hands.
    Linux has to go OUT after some years if they get it their way. They have said it themselves, some two years back: MS: "Linux has come to the end of their live-cycle" (or something like it). I think it is forbidden by law to do it like this, but they have a lot of corruption-money. So... Let's fight it.


    This post was edited by Gerrit rijnsma at January 20, 2012 3:03 AM PST
    • 170 posts
    January 20, 2012 6:37 PM PST
    I am telling everyone I know about Linux. Microsoft is trying so hard to put more pc's in the landfill...Not all manufacturers will block out Linux OS's. Some are even selling with Linux installed.
    • 61 posts
    January 21, 2012 2:36 AM PST

    That's a great developement, Leenie!
    I hope it will stay that way with those Linux-installed and free PC's..

    In the meantime Android: around 50% marketshare on handhelds.
    I think MS is pointing in that direction with this attack. And as a side-effect desktop Linux and possibly others could suffer too.

    I think it is not possible by law, but M$ has a lot of resources and you never know what they can...

     


    This post was edited by Gerrit rijnsma at January 21, 2012 2:39 AM PST